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Post by vicar on Aug 6, 2024 9:37:24 GMT
Saw some pics on twitter last night of trouble in Piccadilly Gardens (or certainly city centre) over the weekend, quite a recognisable County fan right in the middle of the photo clearly involved. I'm not going to post it on here, but wouldn't be surprised if he gets a knock at some point in the coming days. On that subject, if the Premier League clubs did this, I wonder if the EFL clubs would follow suit? It’s only going to add to the feeling of injustice, it's a tough one for clubs as they want to be seen as inclusive but Farage and Robinson are going to milk this.
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Post by stalybridgehatter on Aug 6, 2024 9:38:58 GMT
No one is going down for rioting, as that requires the government to admit it was a riot and then cover all the costs ... Violent disorder all the way! Is it true those thugs at Manchester airport are not yet charged or are out on bail?? They're on bail by all accounts
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Post by The Real Exile on Aug 6, 2024 9:43:24 GMT
Anyone in the Glossop area? We're staying in the Holiday Inn at the end of the M67 and am getting a bit concerned that we might find ourselves under siege 🤣 as in the Premier Inn at Hattersley? Don't worry the locals are all busy chasing the delivery drivers from out side of Mcdonalds so shouldn't reach the hotel. They might regret being nasty to those drivers later when wanting their Big Mac delivered to the comfort of the couch whilst watching Nige on GB News.
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Post by bristolhatter on Aug 6, 2024 9:50:23 GMT
Bit of a glimpse into the first wave of rioters to face the consequences of their decisions: Curtis Coulson, 30, of Sheffield, sobbed from start to finish in his 20 minute court appearance, and cried for his mum as he was refused bail and led away, reports the Times. Ryan Sheers, 28, who was bitten on the backside by a police dog during violence in Hartlepool, cried as he admitted violent disorder, says the Telegraph. Andrew Smith, 41, of High Street East, Sunderland, pleaded guilty to violent disorder, and was crying throughout proceedings, according to Chronicle Live. Delicious fash tears Statements like this are part of the problem. The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely, were their fascists involved in the riots? I have no doubts. Are there fascists in the "anti racist" counter protest lot? Absolutely! As has been mentioned, many of those convicted (or indeed not wise/experienced enough to know to cover faces, how to tread the line without getting arrested etc) will have been angry people who turned up without intention to do what they did and got swept up in the chaos. To say they're all fascist is just lazy and just fuels the ongoing us/them divide.
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Post by timberwolf on Aug 6, 2024 9:53:24 GMT
And this is why it's vitally important as many of the rioters as possible are brought to justice. Yes there will be some hardened 'criminals' amongst them who don't give a shit if they spend a bit of time in prison/add another criminal conviction to their CV, but 90% are just moronic sheep brainwashed by Farage, Yaxley-Lennon and the like. Their downfalls may hopefully help show others close to them that storming hotels and setting fire to Citizen's Advice perhaps isn't the answer to whatever percieved injustices they're feeling. Yep, absolutely. It frightens me to think back to when I was younger and how easy it is to get caught up in situations that are escalating. A couple of dumb decisions and your life is turned upside down. I'd imagine most of these lads are the same. They've not planned for weeks, or even days, how to do this. They've gone along, probably full of frustration and anger and they've made a series of stupid decisions. That's not to excuse them, they deserve everything they get for their part in it. And age isn't really an excuse when some of the ones mentioned above are in their 30s and 40s, but I can definitely see how younger lads get swept up in it all. The vast majority of all ages will never be involved in protests and riots no matter what there age is or the rhetoric of others. Closest i ever got was going on a County march back in the NLN days. Its not to say i,m not interested in whats is going on like millions of others are but will never protest never mind riot if i and others did.
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Post by bigmartin on Aug 6, 2024 9:57:34 GMT
Bit of a glimpse into the first wave of rioters to face the consequences of their decisions: Curtis Coulson, 30, of Sheffield, sobbed from start to finish in his 20 minute court appearance, and cried for his mum as he was refused bail and led away, reports the Times. Ryan Sheers, 28, who was bitten on the backside by a police dog during violence in Hartlepool, cried as he admitted violent disorder, says the Telegraph. Andrew Smith, 41, of High Street East, Sunderland, pleaded guilty to violent disorder, and was crying throughout proceedings, according to Chronicle Live. I have zero sympathy. But what kind of person, giving them the benefit of the doubt in that they'll have a relationship, a job, hobbies, basically 'a life' does this? On the behest of some complete scumbag like Tommy Robinson. It beggars belief. Psychologists could have a field day here.
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Post by bigmartin on Aug 6, 2024 10:04:01 GMT
And this is why it's vitally important as many of the rioters as possible are brought to justice. Yes there will be some hardened 'criminals' amongst them who don't give a shit if they spend a bit of time in prison/add another criminal conviction to their CV, but 90% are just moronic sheep brainwashed by Farage, Yaxley-Lennon and the like. Their downfalls may hopefully help show others close to them that storming hotels and setting fire to Citizen's Advice perhaps isn't the answer to whatever percieved injustices they're feeling. Yep, absolutely. It frightens me to think back to when I was younger and how easy it is to get caught up in situations that are escalating. A couple of dumb decisions and your life is turned upside down. I'd imagine most of these lads are the same. They've not planned for weeks, or even days, how to do this. They've gone along, probably full of frustration and anger and they've made a series of stupid decisions. That's not to excuse them, they deserve everything they get for their part in it. And age isn't really an excuse when some of the ones mentioned above are in their 30s and 40s, but I can definitely see how younger lads get swept up in it all. The starting point is surely that you have to have hate in your heart though right? I can't think of any point in my life where I felt so strongly about a group of people that I'd riot and attempt to do them harm. It's a mental mis-wire for me. The mice in their attics have chewed through the wiring. Probably too much Social Media and utterly propagandized.
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Post by Count de Stockport on Aug 6, 2024 10:11:21 GMT
Statements like this are part of the problem. The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely, were their fascists involved in the riots? I have no doubts. Are there fascists in the "anti racist" counter protest lot? Absolutely! As has been mentioned, many of those convicted (or indeed not wise/experienced enough to know to cover faces, how to tread the line without getting arrested etc) will have been angry people who turned up without intention to do what they did and got swept up in the chaos. To say they're all fascist is just lazy and just fuels the ongoing us/them divide. 'The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely'. Sure does, like when people accuse anti-racists of being fascists. 'Fascism' isn't a catch-all term for 'not nice' or even 'prone to bullying'. It's an ideology, not a personality type. Being angry is no excuse. Plenty of angry people out there who don't turn to racism
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Post by chadders on Aug 6, 2024 10:12:59 GMT
Statements like this are part of the problem. The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely, were their fascists involved in the riots? I have no doubts. Are there fascists in the "anti racist" counter protest lot? Absolutely! As has been mentioned, many of those convicted (or indeed not wise/experienced enough to know to cover faces, how to tread the line without getting arrested etc) will have been angry people who turned up without intention to do what they did and got swept up in the chaos. To say they're all fascist is just lazy and just fuels the ongoing us/them divide. You can carry on making excuses for them being ‘angry’ as though that’s a valid reason for them to smash up towns and cities. I’m very happy for a very clear divide to be drawn between me and them because I’m not a racist scumbag who’s been led on by other thickos on social media.
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Post by Count de Stockport on Aug 6, 2024 10:14:07 GMT
Statements like this are part of the problem. The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely, were their fascists involved in the riots? I have no doubts. Are there fascists in the "anti racist" counter protest lot? Absolutely! As has been mentioned, many of those convicted (or indeed not wise/experienced enough to know to cover faces, how to tread the line without getting arrested etc) will have been angry people who turned up without intention to do what they did and got swept up in the chaos. To say they're all fascist is just lazy and just fuels the ongoing us/them divide. You can carry on making excuses for them being ‘angry’ as though that’s a valid reason for them to smash up towns and cities. I’m very happy for a very clear divide to be drawn between me and them because I’m a racist scumbag who’s been led on by other thickos on social media. Edit incoming!
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Post by Stranded Hatter on Aug 6, 2024 10:19:09 GMT
Statements like this are part of the problem. The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely, were their fascists involved in the riots? I have no doubts. Are there fascists in the "anti racist" counter protest lot? Absolutely! As has been mentioned, many of those convicted (or indeed not wise/experienced enough to know to cover faces, how to tread the line without getting arrested etc) will have been angry people who turned up without intention to do what they did and got swept up in the chaos. To say they're all fascist is just lazy and just fuels the ongoing us/them divide. There won’t have been fascists on the anti racist counter protest. There may well have been authoritarians but not fascists. Fascism is loosely (and it is loose by its very nature) an authoritarian ideology built around nationalism. The nationalist part is about the only bit that’s universal across fascist ideology as it’s very much a broad strokes non ideological ideology. You very much get left wing authoritarians, no denying that and I’ve argued vehemently with a few over the years. They’re not fascists though.
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Post by Stranded Hatter on Aug 6, 2024 10:21:25 GMT
Statements like this are part of the problem. The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely, were their fascists involved in the riots? I have no doubts. Are there fascists in the "anti racist" counter protest lot? Absolutely! As has been mentioned, many of those convicted (or indeed not wise/experienced enough to know to cover faces, how to tread the line without getting arrested etc) will have been angry people who turned up without intention to do what they did and got swept up in the chaos. To say they're all fascist is just lazy and just fuels the ongoing us/them divide. 'The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely'. Sure does, like when people accuse anti-racists of being fascists. 'Fascism' isn't a catch-all term for 'not nice' or even 'prone to bullying'. It's an ideology, not a personality type. Being angry is no excuse. Plenty of angry people out there who don't turn to racism Ironically racism isn’t even a precondition for fascism, it’s just usually along for the ride. Mussolini’s regime wasn’t particularly racist (for the time at least and in its policy making) but was undeniably fascist. Given its where the word even comes from.
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Post by Count de Stockport on Aug 6, 2024 10:21:38 GMT
Statements like this are part of the problem. The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely, were their fascists involved in the riots? I have no doubts. Are there fascists in the "anti racist" counter protest lot? Absolutely! As has been mentioned, many of those convicted (or indeed not wise/experienced enough to know to cover faces, how to tread the line without getting arrested etc) will have been angry people who turned up without intention to do what they did and got swept up in the chaos. To say they're all fascist is just lazy and just fuels the ongoing us/them divide. There won’t have been fascists on the anti racist counter protest. There may well have been authoritarians but not fascists. Fascism is loosely (and it is loose by its very nature) an authoritarian ideology built around nationalism. The nationalist part is about the only bit that’s universal across fascist ideology as it’s very much a broad strokes non ideological ideology. You very much get left wing authoritarians, no denying that and I’ve argued vehemently with a few over the years. They’re not fascists though. Left-wing authoritarian Main Character types are f*cking irritating
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Post by bigmartin on Aug 6, 2024 10:25:42 GMT
'The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely'. Sure does, like when people accuse anti-racists of being fascists. 'Fascism' isn't a catch-all term for 'not nice' or even 'prone to bullying'. It's an ideology, not a personality type. Being angry is no excuse. Plenty of angry people out there who don't turn to racism Ironically racism isn’t even a precondition for fascism, it’s just usually along for the ride. Mussolini’s regime wasn’t particularly racist (for the time at least and in its policy making) but was undeniably fascist. Given its where the word even comes from. Quite correct. Little known fact. For all his many faults, the Italian Army under Mussolini protected their nation's Jewish population from the Final Solution to the intense frustration of Hitler. There was an area in Croatia under Italian Army control which was given the nickname "The Promised Land".
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Post by Count de Stockport on Aug 6, 2024 10:33:06 GMT
Statements like this are part of the problem. The word fascism gets thrown around far too loosely, were their fascists involved in the riots? I have no doubts. Are there fascists in the "anti racist" counter protest lot? Absolutely! As has been mentioned, many of those convicted (or indeed not wise/experienced enough to know to cover faces, how to tread the line without getting arrested etc) will have been angry people who turned up without intention to do what they did and got swept up in the chaos. To say they're all fascist is just lazy and just fuels the ongoing us/them divide. There won’t have been fascists on the anti racist counter protest. There may well have been authoritarians but not fascists. Fascism is loosely (and it is loose by its very nature) an authoritarian ideology built around nationalism. The nationalist part is about the only bit that’s universal across fascist ideology as it’s very much a broad strokes non ideological ideology. You very much get left wing authoritarians, no denying that and I’ve argued vehemently with a few over the years. They’re not fascists though. Nationalism and corporatism, right? Hence the animosity (to put it lightly) between fascism and the left?
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