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Post by Stranded Hatter on Jul 21, 2024 18:53:24 GMT
Biden endorses Harris. Allegedly the rest of the senior party don’t want her, but the likes of Gavin Newsom (who they apparently do want) don’t want to stand.
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Post by bigmartin on Jul 21, 2024 20:22:50 GMT
Definitely. He should never have stood in the first place and the Dems should have had a robust primary to select their candidate. Kamala Harris will be the presumptive nominee and I worry about her against Trump. Then again I worry about anyone senior in the Democratic Party against Trump. I don't think it'll matter who they put in; if there was ever any doubt, that bullet erased it. I reckon we're heading towards a Trump landslide. You may be right. But I was listening to a US Political analyst yesterday who reckons that bullet will harden Trump voters but have very little marked affect on his voting numbers (because they'd vote Trump regardless). Paradoxically he figured it might do the Dems a favour by waking them up and shaking them up to the reality that Trump is about to win. Interesting theory I thought. There certainly seems to be some element of backlash on the cucks with the ear tampons on at his convention. A lot more take on the 'cult' idea.
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Post by vicar on Jul 21, 2024 20:39:36 GMT
Definitely. He should never have stood in the first place and the Dems should have had a robust primary to select their candidate. Kamala Harris will be the presumptive nominee and I worry about her against Trump. Then again I worry about anyone senior in the Democratic Party against Trump. I don't think it'll matter who they put in; if there was ever any doubt, that bullet erased it. I reckon we're heading towards a Trump landslide. I don't think you give Americans enough credit, we see all the MAGA rednecks but a lot of Americans are very smart and don't want this bloke anywhere near the Whitehouse, he's a convicted felon and a sex pest, don't forget he didn't win the popular vote even when he won the presidency.
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Post by Nik on Jul 21, 2024 20:49:22 GMT
I don't think it'll matter who they put in; if there was ever any doubt, that bullet erased it. I reckon we're heading towards a Trump landslide. I don't think you give Americans enough credit, we see all the MAGA rednecks but a lot of Americans are very smart and don't want this bloke anywhere near the Whitehouse, he's a convicted felon and a sex pest, don't forget he didn't win the popular vote even when he won the presidency. Perhaps, I just feel that the middle of the road voters may be swung by the assassination attempt as it (probably rightly) portrays Trump as a sympathetic figure who was the victim of the fierce divide and escalating tensions between voters going too far. I fear that the fact he and his party have been a key factor in said escalation will unfortunately fall by the wayside.
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Post by vicar on Jul 21, 2024 20:53:38 GMT
I don't think you give Americans enough credit, we see all the MAGA rednecks but a lot of Americans are very smart and don't want this bloke anywhere near the Whitehouse, he's a convicted felon and a sex pest, don't forget he didn't win the popular vote even when he won the presidency. Perhaps, I just feel that the middle of the road voters may be swung by the assassination attempt as it (probably rightly) portrays Trump as a sympathetic figure who was the victim of the fierce divide and escalating tensions between voters going too far. I fear that the fact he and his party have been a key factor in said escalation will unfortunately fall by the wayside. The guy who died was a victim, Trump had a tiny wound on his ear, as you say he's stoked up division more than most and I'm sure people will see that.
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Post by scfc29 on Jul 21, 2024 21:04:09 GMT
I don't think it'll matter who they put in; if there was ever any doubt, that bullet erased it. I reckon we're heading towards a Trump landslide. I don't think you give Americans enough credit, we see all the MAGA rednecks but a lot of Americans are very smart and don't want this bloke anywhere near the Whitehouse, he's a convicted felon and a sex pest, don't forget he didn't win the popular vote even when he won the presidency. There’s a lot of Americans that also do want Trump in. Certainly not my way of thinking, but it’s not just the stereotypical red neck that supports him. Biden had to step down, embarrassing it took so long considering his current health but looks like he has finally been pushed. I think they’ll give it Harris knowing that she’s got no chance. Let her take the loss and it will give them enough time to prep someone else for 2028.
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Fez
Contributor
Posts: 568
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Post by Fez on Jul 21, 2024 22:00:36 GMT
I don't think you give Americans enough credit, we see all the MAGA rednecks but a lot of Americans are very smart and don't want this bloke anywhere near the Whitehouse, he's a convicted felon and a sex pest, don't forget he didn't win the popular vote even when he won the presidency. There’s a lot of very Americans that also do want Trump in. Certainly not my way of thinking, but it’s not just the stereotypical red neck that supports him. Biden had to step down, embarrassing it took so long considering his current health but looks like he has finally been pushed. I think they’ll give it Harris knowing that she’s got no chance. Let her take the loss and it will give them enough time to prep someone else for 2028. If the Republican Party were to win - especially by taking the House and Senate as well as the Presidency, and thus controlling all three branches of government - I would fear for the prospect of a free and fair election in 2028. This is the most important US election since… well, since the last one.
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Post by Philcounty on Jul 21, 2024 22:24:21 GMT
This was apparently Jeremy Vine's (now deleted) hot take on the Biden announcement. He actually tagged him in it. I don't want to believe it's real.
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Post by trickster on Jul 21, 2024 23:26:40 GMT
I don't think it'll matter who they put in; if there was ever any doubt, that bullet erased it. I reckon we're heading towards a Trump landslide. I don't think you give Americans enough credit, we see all the MAGA rednecks but a lot of Americans are very smart and don't want this bloke anywhere near the Whitehouse, he's a convicted felon and a sex pest, don't forget he didn't win the popular vote even when he won the presidency. Keeping Trump out would be straight forward enough if the alternative is somebody who people are motivated to get out and vote for. Hillary Clinton invoked the same feelings of revulsion and disgust that Trumpt did for many, Kamala Harris has the same kind of vibe and energy that Hillary had. And frankly the same kind of "oh for f*cks sake" track record. If she gets the nomination, she loses and they get Trump. It isn't enough to rely on people turning out to vote against a villain, the Democrats need to give people something that they actively want to vote in favour of and they're not going to do it.
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Post by Nik on Jul 22, 2024 5:21:58 GMT
This was apparently Jeremy Vine's (now deleted) hot take on the Biden announcement. He actually tagged him in it. I don't want to believe it's real. You can sort of see what he meant it to be, that Biden's had worse days and come through them, as some sort of nod to his resiliency, but f*ck me has he misjudged that one.
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Fez
Contributor
Posts: 568
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Post by Fez on Jul 22, 2024 5:52:40 GMT
I don't think you give Americans enough credit, we see all the MAGA rednecks but a lot of Americans are very smart and don't want this bloke anywhere near the Whitehouse, he's a convicted felon and a sex pest, don't forget he didn't win the popular vote even when he won the presidency. Keeping Trump out would be straight forward enough if the alternative is somebody who people are motivated to get out and vote for. Hillary Clinton invoked the same feelings of revulsion and disgust that Trumpt did for many, Kamala Harris has the same kind of vibe and energy that Hillary had. And frankly the same kind of "oh for f*cks sake" track record. If she gets the nomination, she loses and they get Trump. I'm genuinely interested in any views on Kamala Harris. What is it about her that has the same kind of vibe as Hillary Clinton (who by the way, although I'm not the greatest fan of, was pretty unfairly vilified at times)? And what is it about her track record that's similar? We'll see if she becomes the nominee anyway at the DNC convention in August but it seems most likely (other presumptive candidates like Gavin Newsom having already endorsed her). Before all this, a July 11th poll had Harris performing slightly better than Biden (and indeed Trump) if she were to become the candidate, and there's been a sudden big bump in campaign contributions. On the assumption of a Harris candidacy, Republicans are having to completely switch their narrative; they are adept at that, of course, but it is now they who have to defend not attack the perception of a doddery over-the-hill candidate (Trump is now the oldest candidate who has ever stood for the Presidency). Nothing wrong with age per se but it's clearly affecting Trump's cognition, and has been for some time (along with his manifest faults). We're going to see the usual underhanded stuff - watch out for the Birther movement to re-ignite (pointless because Harris was born in California), and for legal challenges to a switch in candidacy from a number of states (which should also be pointless because Biden was not even the nominee yet). Republicans would like nothing more than to run unopposed in a few states. Given that Harris used to be a prosecutor, how great would it be to see her debate a convicted felon? I don't see Trump agreeing to another debate, though.
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tvor
Frequenter
Posts: 185
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Post by tvor on Jul 22, 2024 7:01:11 GMT
Jesus, you've got it bad Martin. It's Saturday afternoon. Chill for gawd sake. Anyway there is not much point trying to communicating with you when you don't understand the difference between I voted for Brexit and I didn't vote for Brexit. Herbie, I think you also ought to give your head a bit of a wobble as well mate. Voting for Brexit is fine. It's allowed. Many people did. Including you. And you know it. But you can't admit it. I get it. I'm perfectly chilled though thanks for asking. Sadly the rain has just drawn me out of the garden and back into my awning in the beautiful West Lakes, under the backdrop of Black Combe, looking out to the Duddon Estuary and the Irish Sea (hence the delay in responding). It's beautiful, even when raining. And it's a beautiful country we now live in, having shaken the yolk of self-inflicted pyromania a few weeks back. Starmer seems to be meeting the people at the top tables at an equal level rather than being looked down at and laughed at behind his back, and we seem to be back to sensible politics on the whole. Most importantly he's really pissing people like you off. You can try to pretend otherwise, but it oozes from every single post you type. That was a very important part of Labour sweeping the Tories out for me. Right wing loons self-degrading themselves trying to lie, and displaying in plain view their own hypocrisy. It's fantastic. Have you found this secret Whats-app group Nik's not on yet? What's it about out of interest, County or Politics? There are some posters on here have what could best be described as extremist views to say the least. Bigmartin, what year did they allow you to join the extremist Communist Party of Great Britain
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tvor
Frequenter
Posts: 185
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Post by tvor on Jul 22, 2024 7:06:01 GMT
Positive movement but it’s not the first time it has happened, usually when there are too many for the french boat to carry safely. Oh and the uk sorted a deal with Albania about 18 months ago, thats why their numbers crossing dropped so drastically. I hope Starmer does a good job, sunak didn’t that’s for sure, I just have doubts bigmartin, Labour have been in power less than two weeks, not a month! mreckless, we've seen some very positive moves in resetting the relationship with Europe. The Tories were always trying to fight a war with EU countries, but now we've got a grown up who is looking to work together as a partner. I think that has been recognised. I think setting up an asylum centre in Calais would be a good start. It would open up a safe and legal option for genuine asylum seekers, that we have a legal and moral obligation to help. It would also send a clear message to anyone that was looking to cross the channel in small boat, that they have no genuine need to take that route, no need to risk their life taking and illegal route - unless they are an economic migrant, who would have their claim rejected. I think this would enable the government to deal with claims made by anyone who crosses in a small boat in a completely different manner, allowing the claim to be processed much faster and most likely rejected. The long term solution is to re-join the EU and apply the Dublin Convention, so economic migrants could be returned to the first safe EU country, which is where they should be applying for asylum.
Yes, that would be an existing member of the EU - FRANCE. And what do they do, point them in our direction PDQ. Time to put put a few hundred British soldiers back on the Normandy beaches with authority to stop boats leaving by whatever force is required.
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Post by mattyovrio on Jul 22, 2024 7:08:35 GMT
They're all flawed though in different ways. In terms of representative, constituency based, democracy I've listened to views on alternative voting systems and I'm not sure how/why they would actually work in this country. A strong argument in terms of turnout is that it's your job as a Parliamentarian to foment turnout. And if you can't rouse people enough with your policy to turn out and vote for you ("no point"), then it's on you. I think we could easily have two elected chambers. One utilising an STV/AV/RankedChoice constituency system so people still have their local MP. Then another that is elected nationally by proportional representation. The former house would likely be larger. This video recently appeared on my YouTube feed and I thought it was an interesting concept. Not one I’ve come across before. Smart young. Não and very well put. I like it.
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Post by herbiedumplings on Jul 22, 2024 7:10:13 GMT
Given that Harris used to be a prosecutor, how great would it be to see her debate a convicted felon? I don't see Trump agreeing to another debate, though. I can see hitherto undetected deafness due to the helix of his ear being nicked by a bullet being used as an excuse to avoid anything unscripted between now and the election.
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