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Post by countybumpkin on Apr 19, 2024 16:52:43 GMT
Not sure your issue with the Champions League specifically in truth, it's putting on games pitting the best players in the World against each other and (in the main) and (in the knockouts) it's fantastic entertainment that people are willing to tune in (and often pay) to watch. It's not UEFA's fault that more people want to do that than put money in to watching the lower leagues. Is it any different to Elton John continually selling out concerts and lining his pockets (at extortionate cost to the attendees) no doubt? or should he be stepping aside to allow a band that play at the Thatched House on a Saturday night have some limelight? You're right the knockout stuff is exciting which is why the old European cup was far better Definitely was. Bollocks to the “Champions” League. It doesn’t even make sense. It’s like calling the American domestic baseball competition ‘The World Series’. Both names are just shite advertising slogans which no one is fooled by. Actually, some people are.
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Post by gibbo on Apr 19, 2024 17:47:51 GMT
Finishing 2nd in League 1 and you've won promotion to the Championship Finish 2nd in the Prem and you've won a place in the Champions League......
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Post by Stranded Hatter on Apr 19, 2024 17:53:19 GMT
Finishing 2nd in League 1 and you've won promotion to the Championship Finish 2nd in the Prem and you've won a place in the Champions League...... You shouldn't though. Not ahead of the FA Cup and League Cup winners. Promotion is different, win promotion to the Championship and you don't play in the Trophy any more, finish 2nd in the Premier League and you're still in the FA Cup and League Cup the following year. And the Football League Trophy isn't the FA Cup or the League Cup for that matter. Even before it got poisoned by Premier League youth teams. We're going to go round in circles here. We disagree, that's fine.
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Post by gibbo on Apr 19, 2024 17:54:11 GMT
It's a poor comparison because Elton John doesn't engage in a competitive (ha!) league to compete in a different league. But you'll be happily celebrating our promotion tomorrow Moz won't you? funded by Mark Stott's money, which has made National League / League 2 an unequal playing fields in terms of wealth has it not ?? (actually no different to the Premier League / Champions League, albeit on a smaller scale?)
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Post by gibbo on Apr 19, 2024 18:00:31 GMT
Finish 2nd in the Prem and you've won a place in the Champions League...... You shouldn't though. . Whether you shouldn't wasn't the argument though Stranded, currently you do get a Champions League place (a place in the best club competition in the world), so currently that Champions League place is more prestigious (whether you and Mozzer like it or not) than winning the FA Cup.
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Post by FridoBiggins on Apr 19, 2024 18:00:47 GMT
I'd be giving the FA until the end of today to make a statement saying they'll 'pause and discuss'. If they haven't worked out how big the bollock is that they've dropped by now, you can just throw it on the pile of reasons they're not fit for purpose. If they fail to do so, clubs should immediately be looking to take this a stage beyond strongly worded statements. Boycotting the competition should be top of the list of threats. Agree, boycott it. The FA will threaten clubs with sanctions and fines but if clubs/fans stand together the FA will back down. Ridiculous, as more than half the teams in the PL could potentially be playing in the EFL in the next few years. Clearly, this is being driven by the'top' PL teams and it's about time that they were put in their place.
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Post by Mozzer on Apr 19, 2024 18:09:54 GMT
It's a poor comparison because Elton John doesn't engage in a competitive (ha!) league to compete in a different league. But you'll be happily celebrating our promotion tomorrow Moz won't you? funded by Mark Stott's money, which has made National League / League 2 an unequal playing fields in terms of wealth has it not ?? (actually no different to the Premier League / Champions League, albeit on a smaller scale?) Again, I've covered this in this thread already. I never said I was after a socialist paradise that never existed in football anyway. Money has always talked. The question is the extent to which it's acceptable for clubs with money to essentially fix the competition(s) to weigh heavily in their favour to acquire more wealth at the expense of others and, as far as English football goes, how that wealth and power is then used to skew the game in their favour at the expense of the rest of football. This is different to clubs simply having owners with lots of money.
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Post by Stranded Hatter on Apr 19, 2024 18:10:25 GMT
Whether you shouldn't wasn't the argument though Stranded, currently you do get a Champions League place (a place in the best club competition in the world), so currently that Champions League place is more prestigious (whether you and Mozzer like it or not) than winning the FA Cup. Throughout the history of the FA Cup winning that has always carried more prestige than finishing 2nd in the league. That only changed with the change of the Champions League. It became self fulfilling prophecy. I would much rather see County win the FA or League Cup than finish 2nd in the Premier League. We disagree. Neither of us will change the other’s mind. So shall we just leave it? Like I suggested before.
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Post by FridoBiggins on Apr 19, 2024 18:19:49 GMT
Whether you shouldn't wasn't the argument though Stranded, currently you do get a Champions League place (a place in the best club competition in the world), so currently that Champions League place is more prestigious (whether you and Mozzer like it or not) than winning the FA Cup. Throughout the history of the FA Cup winning that has always carried more prestige than finishing 2nd in the league. That only changed with the change of the Champions League. It became self fulfilling prophecy. I would much rather see County win the FA or League Cup than finish 2nd in the Premier League. We disagree. Neither of us will change the other’s mind. So shall we just leave it? Like I suggested before. The vast majority of teams (and I would also argue fans) have got no aspirations of getting in to the PL, nevermind winning it. They all dream of a good FA Cup run though. We are being dictated to by a tiny, tiny minority of teams. We, as the majority, should set the rules. If they don't like it, let them withdraw from the tournament.
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Post by gibbo on Apr 19, 2024 18:34:27 GMT
I would much rather see County win the FA or League Cup than finish 2nd in the Premier League. I doubt that would be the case if we got to that point. I'd take Champions League any day.
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Post by gibbo on Apr 19, 2024 18:37:49 GMT
I never said I was after a socialist paradise You're far more intelligent than me Mozzer in fairness, I don't even know what that means. (bored of this "Champions" love in though so was a good debate... )
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Post by gibbo on Apr 19, 2024 18:39:04 GMT
You're right the knockout stuff is exciting which is why the old European cup was far better You've got me on that one 73.....
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Post by Stranded Hatter on Apr 19, 2024 18:53:25 GMT
I would much rather see County win the FA or League Cup than finish 2nd in the Premier League. I doubt that would be the case if we got to that point. I'd take Champions League any day. Not me. We have different preferences so won't see eye to eye. So again, let's drop it.
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Post by mattyovrio on Apr 19, 2024 18:57:20 GMT
I never said I was after a socialist paradise You're far more intelligent than me Mozzer in fairness, I don't even know what that means. (bored of this "Champions" love in though so was a good debate... ) One of the few debates if not the only one where you didn’t have a dig at Lord Jim of Gannon - well done!🤣💥🥳
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Post by gibbo on Apr 19, 2024 19:00:57 GMT
We have different preferences We don't, we have views at different stages of our lifecycles of support (dependent on age I assume), you're still in the: "we're lower League, I hate Premier League" position. I'm the: "we're all part of the same pyramid, lets achieve as much as possible"
I also doubt Stott is (within financial reason) ever going to put the handbrake on our progression. Have it right, if we go up next season (a stretch I know) he'll go all out for the Premier League within a couple of seasons. (he aint gonna say that just because Mozzer and Stranded don't like it then I don't want to be in the Premier League)
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